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The Catparrot
19th June 2002, 11:26 PM
What a shocker after racing there on Saturday. Did anyone have a bet there? Glad I didn't.

becareful
20th June 2002, 10:31 AM
Couldn't resist the $21 on Unitab for Purely Academic in race 1 :grin:

Had a couple of other bets on $20 runners during the day but nothing else came in - these were all just "fun" bets while I was waiting for the Adelaide/Brisbane races so I only had a few dollars on each - I never risk serious money on a Slow or Heavy track, especially Sandown or Kensington!

quapi
20th June 2002, 12:31 PM
Good pick up. Comments in http://www.propun.com.au/betting_advice.html

20th June 2002, 12:38 PM
Whats wrong with value horses winning???

Isn't that what you guys are always on about??

I would be interested in your explanation.

I wouldn't mind backing a few of these, especially the Rocky Glen trifecta:

Horse Tote Odds Trifecta Odds
Purely Academic $21.00 $6341
Datari $18.80 $1044
Born To Dream $5.60 $2507
Zero Isle $16.00 $5952
Fifeshire $7.00 $984
Freegold $15.10 $1303
Rocky Glen $40.30 $92,259
Granniah $13.30 $4036




<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: quapi on 2002-06-20 15:13 ]</font>

quapi
20th June 2002, 12:59 PM
When people follow the appropriate course and e mail us with queries and comments we are quite happy to respond as time permits. Please see Forum Terms of Use.
Management.

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: quapi on 2002-06-20 15:15 ]</font>

becareful
20th June 2002, 02:11 PM
Chief,

As a "value punter" I have no problem with value horses winning as long as you have some chance of picking the real value - unfortunately with tracks like Sandown yesterday it is too much of a lottery.

Of course in hindsite you could have made a killing yesterday by simply backing anything over $10 on the tote (there's a tip for everyone next time they run a meeting on a wet Sandown track!).

Equine Investor
20th June 2002, 05:33 PM
Tried to tell you all about Sandown!

:wink:

But it isn't that hard really to find a winner.

1. Disregard any good form.

2. Circle any horse that hasn't won in 12 months.

3. Circle any horse that has the worst prizemoney.

4. Circle any horse over 8/1 in prepost betting.

There are your winners!

Reenster
21st June 2002, 10:21 AM
Nobody actually won $92,000+ on the Race 7 trifecta. The total pool was only $53,802. This means there were 2 winners on the trifecta in that race:

1. The lucky bugger with one unit on that combination (a mystery bet?)who collected about $46,000.

2. Tabcorp, who took the other 7K (that's around 15%)for accepting the bets.

Then there was their commission on the Win, Place, Quinella, Exacta, Doubles. AND DON'T GET ME STARTED ON ROUNDING.

Actually, Tabcorp had a great day out at Sandown on Wednesday.

Come to think of it Tabcorp won at every venue on Wednesday.

Come to think of it Tabcorp NEVER loses.

Cheers

quapi
21st June 2002, 11:40 AM
Thanks Reenster.
We'll include that in Punt to Win.

21st June 2002, 11:41 AM
Why do they say it paid $92k, if it didn't?

becareful
21st June 2002, 01:20 PM
Chief - all TAB dividends are exressed as a dividend PER UNIT wagered. In this case there was a single winner who only wagered half a unit - therefore the dividend is shown as twice what he actually won. Whenever a large Trifecta div is shown you always need to check the pool size to see if the div was really that big or if it has been doubled by only having a half unit winner.

21st June 2002, 01:41 PM
You learn something every day.
You can tell I hardly ever bet trifectas.
Can't stand the long run of outs.

So if the person had bet 1 unit or 10 units, because of the pool size and the fact he was the only winner, he would have still only received $46,000 in total??

So if one is punting very rough trifectas, only have half units, cause you win the same amount regardless of units bet, as long as you are the only winner.

However, if two people had won that trifecta - one had a half unit and one a full unit - first person gets 1/3 of $46,000 and the other gets 2/3 of $46,000??

becareful
21st June 2002, 01:54 PM
Chief - yes all your analysis there is right - definitely only bet 1/2 unit if betting on rough trifectas.

PS. Does anyone know the rules for the various TAB's if NOBODY has the selected combination? I believe that Supertab pays out on the selected horses in any order (ie. if it was 15-13-11 past post but nobody had this in trifecta they will pay on 11-13-15, 13-11-15, etc)? I could not find any reference on any of the TABs websites to the actual rule in this case.

Reenster
21st June 2002, 02:04 PM
You're right Chief. You can't win one cent more than what's in the total pool for that race. If the person who landed the trifecta on this race had put, say $5 (10 units) on that combination, the trifecta would have only paid $9,200. Yet if he was the only winner, he would have still collected $46,000.

In fact, from memory, the NSW and QLD TAB trifecta divvies on the same race paid $15,000 and $13,000 respectively. I'm not sure what the pools were in those states but there were obviously more winning tickets.

The one thing that never changes is the commission that goes to the TAB.

Big Orange
21st June 2002, 02:26 PM
The retention of the fifty cent bet allows the TAB to:

1. Round down more severely than necessary to the detriment of all its punters, but particularly those whose bets are usually in the shorter price bracket;

2. Declare dividends which are sometimes theoretical, ie no such dividend was actually paid or received (as is the case with a single live ticket at 50c);

3. Provide a betting medium that is now inferior to a growing number of non-tote off-course alternatives;

4. Pretend that the value of 50 cents has remained constant over 35 years or more;

5. Forget about the TAB punter as a service consumer. The TAB is serving its own interest first;

6. Disregard the changing demographic of their clientele;

7. Increase their take of every pool beyond the acknowledged percentage;

8. ummm ...... can't think of any more but I'm sure someone else can. :smile:

mr magic
21st June 2002, 02:55 PM
With flexi betting in NSW, what happens if the only successful bet on the Tri is a 1% flexi bet? If the pool payable on the race is $50000 would the dividend be declared as $5 million?
Imagine the TAB puppets at Sky carrying on about that one.

Privateer
21st June 2002, 03:58 PM
Exactly Tulloch. I don't know why everyone is so surprised at the results.

It was a wet track in Melbourne in Winter.

The rail was well out (one of the biggest hazards for punters).

The quality of runners was average to poor.

It was mid week.

I took one look at the form and track conditions for ALL of Wednesday's racing then went to the movies.

I'll bet at Sandown, but only when the conditions suit me.

21st June 2002, 04:29 PM
Well said Privater.
Couldn't agree more - plus Melb is full of dodgy people!! LOL

Equine Investor
21st June 2002, 04:34 PM
:lol:

not me I hope!