The tipping comp rules suggestions for next time

[Seeker11]

I have this listed on the Oaks day comp thread but thought they might get lost there.

My suggestions for the next big tipping comp (Autumn carnival I suppose) are as follows:

(1) I think that its OK that we can select from any race meeting as that gives those that have special knowledge of racing in say WA, SA and QLD a chance. As long as the races are Metropolitan and are on UNItab and keep the feature race

(2) Do not allow any changes to tips once a participant's first selected race has begun. The forum keeps a record of edits so that should be OK.

(3) Perhaps to avoid issues of time discrepancy we need to set a half hour limit prior to a participant's first race selection to enter that week's comp, or to make changes prior to the commencement meaning if you first selection is at Race 2 at 1pm the latest you can enter or update you selections is at 12:30pm etc

(4) I agree that the competition ladder should be based on returns and not profit as this will help us that competed the whole way through the comp. This means that we could either keep or dump the scratchings carry-over.

(5) I think that we could allow E/W betting (I had a pretty good comp selecting placegetters that earned me nothing due to the win only rule)

I want to congratulate SportzNut and all those that have assisted with rule creation and policing and calculating the ladder after each round. Despite all the issues this has continued to be a successful competition run by the participants even though only pride is at stake.

[sportznut]

Okay, a few ideas:

I think it's okay if we stray away from the big races, but we should stick to metro racing only (Bris, Syd, Melb, Adel, Perth)

Regarding when you put your tips in, I think we could make the cutoff point the jump time of the first Metro race of the day. I know that's pretty strict, but most people do that already anyway, and everyone would know where everyone else stands.

I also have an idea regarding the feature race of the day. It's along the lines of the tips that you guys give on Paddy's feature race threads where you each pick four horses. I think we should have a go at a 4 horse box trifecta and quinella each week in our feature race. I think that would add a lot of interest. We could pick 4 horses, plus a couple of 'reserves' in case of scratchings. What do you think?

I agree that I think we should allow each-way betting as well as win betting and I think we should allow either $10 or $20 to be bet on any one race.

I think we should have $100 to bet with each week instead of $50. $30 could go on that 4 horse box trifecta/quinella idea I mentioned and that would leave a further $70 for win or each-way betting. That would allow more flexibility than at the moment.

I also agree that perhaps we could calculate it on returns instead of profit, and I think we should probably keep the rule allowing people to have extra selections if they've had scratchings the previous week.

I also have another idea. Instead of having a comp that goes for 3 months, how about we have a separate comp for each month of the year. At the moment, we get a lot of people dropping out after a few weeks and we also get many people who join in too late and don't have any chance of winning. If we ran a different comp for each month of the year we wouldn't have to worry about that. If you guys are interested in that, then we might start up a new one month comp for December.

[Oaksnaf]

I am new so I am all ears.
Sounds great Sportznut.

Each month should be a new competition.
Exotics are always fun.

Just start it up in Dec and I will tip away.

[sportzRus]

Some kind of handicapping system.
Say a starting $ deduction, eg. 75% of your overall most recent competition profit, if you were skilled enough to finish in the black in your last competition.

Thought about the other way as well ($ value start based on how badly you did in your last competition) but thought that might perhaps be something for later, if the above was adopted and worked OK.

[Seeker11]

Sportznut,

I like everything you suggested but am a little concerned about betting with exotics regularly. I for one try and avoid multiples.

You will either need to set a top limit of $30, or make it compulsory that you spend exactly $30 on the feature race each week.

However, if all the rules are clear and agreed to by all then I have no problems with the multiples

Im not so sure about SportsRuz's suggestion about a handicapping system. I would prefer that each month is a fresh comp where everyone starts at zero. Again I will be happy with clear rules and majority rule on all rules
_________________
may the horse be with you

Seeker

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Seeker11 on 2004-11-06 11:34 ]</font>

[sportznut]

Yes, it would be a set $30 and it would ALWAYS be a 4 horse box trifecta and quinella. For a $1 unit, that's $30. We could make it a 50cent unit to bring it back to $15, but it would ALWAYS be a 4 horse box. That way, there's no confusion.

[sportznut]

Yeah, I'm not too keen on SportzRus' idea either. I think if you have a different comp each month with everyone starting at zero, that's okay. And starting a new comp each month means you don't have to worry about all the people dropping out or joining too late and having no chance.

[punts2]

Merit in sportzRus suggestion. Might also encourage a few more participants.

[sportznut]

Here's another idea. How about all the money from all the scratchings gets carried over to the last day of each competition. Could lead to an exciting finish with some people having a fair bit of extra money to bet with on the last day. As well as keeping a tally on tipsters returns, we would also keep a progressive tally of this scratching money so that everyone knows where everyone else stands.


<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: sportznut on 2004-11-07 11:22 ]</font>

[suds]

On 2004-11-07 11:14, sportznut wrote:
Here's another idea. How about all the money from all the scratchings gets carried over to the last day of each competition. Could lead to an exciting finish with some people having a fair bit of extra money to bet with on the last day. As well as keeping a tally on tipsters returns, we would also keep a progressive tally of this scratching money so that everyone knows where everyone else stands.


<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: sportznut on 2004-11-07 11:22 ]</font>




So if you had a couple of scratchings each week (not hard to do) how can you bet that extra on the last day - anyway you want.
And if you get scratchings on the last day then what?

[umrum]

I'm a bit dirty at the backlash from my bet in Kalgoorlie. I mean it was an $100 000 listed race and was the best race in WA on that weekend. I wonder if it was a 4/5 on pop whether everyone would have chucked a stink. Also I think s-tab divi's would be better as they cover a lot more meeting's. And just because it says spring carnival tipping comp does not mean that you have to bet exclusively on melbourne. The origional concept was so that all the spruikers in here could prove that they can turn a profit on the punt, be that Bong Bong, Dapto or Kalgoorlie. Anyway that's my rant.

cheers
umrum

[sportznut]

What backlash Umrum? I don't think everyone's 'chucked a stink'. There have been other tipsters who've picked horses in non metro races too. I just think that perhaps we should try to stick to Metro races in future. Keeping the tips to Bris, Syd, Melb, Adel and Perth still leaves plenty of races to choose from. But I'm open to suggestions from others as to what races they think we should use.

[umrum]

ok sports,

I just dont see the need to restrict where you can bet.

Also thanks to yourself and shaun for taking the reins this spring.

cheers mate

[sportznut]

Well, there's a little while till we start the next comp, so we'll have a bit more of a think about it.

[trench digger]

Hi All,

firstly thanks to Sportsnut for administering this comp.

I don't understand why the consenus is that Provincials & Country meetings be excluded from the next comp.

Surley it takes as much skill to tip a winner in the bush or the city!

I do not agree that place or exotics be included in future comps.

I suggest in future comps we must select a winner a week or each 2 weeks in our 5 selections or be eliminated .

Reason being to keep interest for the full duration, to stop contestants "just picking roughies" and finally so we have some chance of beating Shaun & Ors come the last weeks of the comp.

Just my opinons.

[Raw Instinct]

I would rather there be E/W betting what is the difference between picking a horse that wins a race at 5-1 compared to picking a horse that pys $10 for a place I am sorry but I don't understand why that causes a problem. It is just as hard to pick a roughie so to speak to run a place as it does to pick a winner.

[sportznut]

Yeah, I agree about the Each-way betting. I think it would be a good idea. If people don't want to use it, then they don't have to.

We definitely shouldn't allow Place betting though. Just Win or Each-way.


<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: sportznut on 2004-11-12 09:37 ]</font>

[Seeker11]

With each way betting there is an opportunity to pick from further a field in any selected race. Then there may have been more people selecting Sky Cuddle and Zazzman.

I am also against everyone having to select from 4 or 5 "feature" races each week that would mean that many competitors will end up picking a more limited bunch of horses most likely from the top 3 favourites.

Keep the one "feature" race (move it around to different states even during the carnivals) and then the form guide is ours. As Um Rum said this is a chance for us to take more risk and show off on our selections so I too don't have a problem selecting from provincial meetings.

My big question is does this include the New Zealand races???


_________________
may the horse be with you

Seeker

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Seeker11 on 2004-11-12 16:29 ]</font>

[umrum]

i have absolutely no problems with people having new zealand races as part of their selections. One week it should have just about been the feature race(the kelt).

cheers
umrum

[Trent]

Sounds like a very interesting comp. Looking forward to December, though I don't think I will be troubling the winners circle.

[Shaun]

E/W betting is ok with me....most of the other rules seam ok....if we are going to run for one month and use returns instead of profit why bother about adding scratchings.....if i win 100 and use say 30 and some wins 50 and uses 40 whats the difference you are not calculating what they spent just what they won.....

[umrum]

On 2004-11-16 11:06, Shaun wrote:
E/W betting is ok with me....most of the other rules seam ok....if we are going to run for one month and use returns instead of profit why bother about adding scratchings.....if i win 100 and use say 30 and some wins 50 and uses 40 whats the difference you are not calculating what they spent just what they won.....


yeah your right shaun. need to show profit.
cheers