LOL

Bordi you are in the serious minority here. you keep saying she won the few races she was trained for - and i say again, so did the 14 horses above her. she had a weaker strike rate than all of the horses above her (and yes some of them were stayers too)

Can't see her feat being repeated any time soon. Melbourne Cups aren't just average staying handicaps won by slow plodders any more. Generally takes a pretty classy horse to win one these days. And it takes a BRILLIANT horse to win 3 straight!!!

well said sportz....


minority u say? say wat u like.... the facts are on the table. she won more prize money then any other horse in australian history (grossed up to take into account inflation and race money also) she broke many many many records including record time in aus cup, 3 melb cups, cox- melb double in the one year, weight carrying records... and plenty more. The basic fact is this... she has done what no other in history has...........

No Offense
 

Kingston Town would have picked her up and carried her over 2000m. Every professional that I know of rate the Cox Plate a far superior race to the Melbourne Cup.

Just my opinion.

Bordi I don't whether I need to ask the question but what is your top 10 horses you have done nothing but bag evryone elses opinion so how about putting it out there for everyone else to have a go at.

She was a great horse but she wasn't the best how could anyone say anything is better than anything else until the day they invent a time machine and can race all the best horses over time against eachother at peek fitness in the best of conditions the maybe someone can argue one is better than the other.

As far as the prize money thing goes well they have done Pharlaps career earnings using the figures from the year 2000 and he actually won more prize money than she did when it is done like that. Kingston Town would be right up there I imagine aswell with 3 Cox Plates at todays rates to go with all the other races he won.

This is all one persons opinion everyone has there own I personally think Starcraft was as good a miler as I have seen race and most people do not share that opinion, The problem was that most of Australia hated the horse probably firstly because he was a Queenslander and secondly because of the owner, However I do give him alot of credit he did things other owners wouldn't do and in my opinion when Starcraft went to the UK and won he did more for Australian racing than anyone before him he beat the poms at a distance they like to think they have very good horses at where as it has always been questioned that there sprinters are truly world class still Choisir's feats should never be knocked either.

Exactly raw.

Bordi, the challenge is there. post your top 10 and see what everyone says

As Raw said, it's damn hard to compare horses of different eras, and thumbs up to Chuck for having a go. For what it's worth, this would be my top 10:

01 - PHAR LAP
02 - TULLOCH
03 - KINGSTON TOWN
04 - BERNBOROUGH
05 - CARBINE
06 - MAKYBE DIVA
07 - MANIKATO
08 - MIGHT AND POWER
09 - PETER PAN
10 - RISING FAST

raw - what about poor old Reset? 5 wins from 5 (including G1s Cadbury Guineas and Futurity Stks) before sold to stud....and it beat Starcraft twice ;)

This is mine for the record. As stated it's only one man's opinion so chill out Bordi ; )

1. Tulloch
2. Phar Lap
3. Northerly
4. Kingston Town
5. Sunline
6. Tobin Bronze
7. Bernborough
8. Rising Fast
9. Manikato
10. Might and Power

Retrospective” Group One winners List


This list is based on allocating respective Group One status in wins of races upgraded since 1978/9.

Rank Horse Group 1 Wins
1. Manikato 21 wins
2. Tulloch 19 wins
3. Ajax 17 wins
4. Wenona Girl 15 wins
5. KingstonTown 14 wins
5. Sky High 14 wins
7. Phar Lap 13 wins
7. Sunline 13 wins
9. Tie The Knot 13 wins
10. Rough Habit 12 wins
11. Amounis 11 wins
11. Bonecrusher 11 wins
11. Eurythnic 11 wins
11. Wakeful 11 wins
15. Octagonal 10 wins
15. Tobin Bronze 10 wins


List courtesy of Peter Tonkes and Bloodhorse Review.




“Overall” Group One winners List


This list is based on allocating Group One status to “missing Group One” events pre 1978/9. That is, taking the nation’s best races during that period which would have been Group One recognised had such a system been in place)

Rank Horse Group 1 Wins
1. Phar Lap 27 wins
1. Tulloch 27 wins
2. Carbine 25 wins
3. Ajax 24 wins
4. Manikato 21 wins
5. Gloaming 19 wins
5. High Caste 19 wins
5. Sky High 19 wins
8. Beau Vite 18 wins
8. Wakeful 18 wins
10. Amouinis 17 wins
10. Chester 17 wins
10. Eurythmic 17 wins
10. Hydrogen 17 wins
10. Limerick 17 wins
10. Trafalgar 17 wins

Lol
you have me there Chuck however Starcrafts results were far better away from this country then they were in the country atleast he hung around for awhile for us to watch the sheer fact that Reset had one prep and one only certainly has to put a bit of a knock on him.

Raw,
i do not know what you are takling about.... maybe u should read papers and facts more. they did an article just b4 or after the melb cup comparing the prizemoney of the two up to date and makybe diva was around 500k in front after the cup... so get ur facts right.......

I have my facts right my friend I got the prizemoney figures out of the Race track magazine where they did a comparison between Makybe Diva and Pharlap the difference being they included his win of the Agua Caliente as the modern day version of the Breeders Cup race and that is what made him a higher money earner.

Well I managed to find the article and have typed it onto a spredsheet for anyone who wants to check it out anyway obviously there are races that do not exist anymore they were taken as there modern day equivalent.

I think one of the points concerning Makybe Diva was that she retired when she was at her absolutely dominant best and that if she had continued she would possibly have been one of the UNDOUBTABLE all time greatest but as it is I prefer Sunline as a racemare.


Before her first Melb. Cup win she was just a good handicapper. Between her 1st and 2nd cup she won only one race - the Sydney Cup, but in between her 2nd and 3rd cup she was untouchable.
It was only her last 12 months that had her in the stellar division of gallopers, maybe a little harsh, but if she had raced on, who knows.

Sunline was at the very top of the tree from her 3yr old year, won two Cox Plates and won overseas.

It really is a futile argument as is comparisons in any sport over differnet eras.

I you want to see how one paced Makybe Diva is, have a look at the Australian Cup 2004, when Lonhro got checked, with more weight and still accelerated away with more weight on him.

She was a one paced plodder, won all three Melbourne Cups the same way, and she didn't have a turn of foot.

And the last win of her's was sullied by the track watering fiasco.

enjoying insanity... you really are a XXXXXXXXXX to make a comment lyk that. she demolished the australian cup course record, something lohnro didnt do..... yo XXXXXXXXXXX bout racing...

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