UK RACING / OVERSEAS RACING
 

I will be starting a thread on Uk racing and I will be posting as often as I can. I am quite happy to answer any questions on Uk racing and using Betfair for Uk betting. So if you have any, please post them here and lets get the ball rolling.

Cheers,

Vance.

Hi, Vance.

When the U.K. bookies release their prices does it have any influence on the already large Betfair market that might give us a clue as to which way a horse may go in the betting? Maybe because there is a difference in prices due to the fact that bookies frame an initial market of approx 125% as opposed to approx 102% on Betfair, it might be difficult to predict anything?

Do you know if there is anything to look for or take into account that may not apply to our racing or anything that we may not normally be aware of that might be helpful?

There are so many ads on the web about winning on U.K. racing that one would expect it to be a "walk in the park". Not so...?

Michael.

Morning Vance

How long have you been operating on UK races on Betfair, and do you make consistent profits? Also, do you contribute to the BF forum?

Mark

Hi Vance,

I have been laying horses in the U.K on and off for several months. I stick to warm favourites no longer than 3.50. I have found it to be very lucrative. My personal best streak was 16 warm favs in a row going down. I have found the U.K markets much easier to navigate, and as you say - more liquidity. With my work committments, doing some form in the evening suits me perfectly. I have also found the markets are pretty much set from around 7.30-8.30pm. My main laying revolves around 2yo & maiden races.

All the best with it!

UK RACING
 

GOOD MORNING TO YOU ALL!

Please forgive me if anything I say below is obvious to you all, I am only trying to help!

Young buck,

Interesting! I have a very similar strategy. I look for false favourites that I believe are maybe a bit too to short in the betting. Usually under $3.00. Maidens, 2yr olds and novice hurdles and condition, listed, and group races. I also have been laying greyhounds with good success too.
Well done with your results though, 16 successful lays, awesome!
Like you, its suits me to do the form in the evening and I can usually get a good bet on before it gets to late. Keep up the good work yourself and thanks for your good wishes!

Mark,

I have been doing the Uk races for about 18 months now and I now do it full time. I avoid the Betfair forum and I dont post on it. I am a bit wary of the betfair forum. I sometimes look through it for topics of interest, but if I do have a query, I call the betfair helpdesk (very friendly and helpful).
I also belong to a few good UK forums and I post there. Ive picked up so much good info. and learned so much. I have found the pommies to be very helpful and prepared to share their ideas. Just like this forum.

Michael,

With practice and experience it can be relatively straight forward to make money on the UK racing scene! But it is not as easy as the many ads on the web make out. Do what you have been doing on the OZ scene successfully and you will be fine.
By the the time the UK bookies release their prices I have found it has little impact on the betfair market.
I do get a good idea of which way the market will go though. Because if there is a greater amount of money waiting to be matched, for example, on the lay side rather than the back side, then generally through " weight of money" the price will be forced down, that is more punters wanting to back the outcome than punters willing to lay an outcome. As such, you can back the horse at the prevailing price and if you predict correctly the price will shorten, it will provide you with a zero-risk opprtunity to lay your bet back. And vice versa.
I am a layer but I am becoming increasingly aware of these trading opportunities to make risk free money as they do happen quite often.
Our racing is similar to theirs however they do have a lot of jumping events. The main differece between us and them with regard to betfair would be that due to the high liquidity you can lay a horse on the Uk, hours before a race starts at a good price. I have found that with liquidity on the OZ racing being poor until 15 minutes say, before the starting time of a race, you have to bet on your computer throughout the day to lay the runners.

Hope this answers your questions.Cheers everyone and have a good day- keep the questions coming,

Vance.

Thanks, Vance, for your thoughts. Much appreciated.

Do you have any suggestions re hearing (or seeing?) the UK races. Have been listening through Ladbrokes; but this is probably not the best?

USEFUL LINKS FOR UK RACING
 

USEFUL LINKS FOR UK RACING.

Some of these websites you might have to register to access the info. required, but in most cases its free.

For form, research and results: racingpost.co.uk
sportinglife.com

To get early prices try: oddschecker.com

To listen to the races / get odds: willhill.com
ladbrokes.com

Note: Merriguy - I prefer to listen through will hill, but I still use ladbrokes now and again.

To watch the races on your PC: attheraces.com
racinguk.tv

To find out the time in England:http://times.clari.net.au

I will add any further links when they come to mind.

Vance

Answered my question --- and more. Thanks, Vance! :)

Stirling effort vance, thanks.

UK RADIO
 

Thanks guys for appreciation. Just a tip - Bear in mind when listening to the commentaries of the UK races that they are always 20 - 30 seconds behind real time so dont use this for laying or betting "in running"!
Any questions out there from anyone, feel free to post.

Thanks, Vance, for all the information.

I didn't even realise they fielded the U.K. greyhounds. Will also take a look at them.

I would assume that just like the U.K the early liquidity on our races will hopefully increase to such an extent that we wouldn't have to sit at our computers a few minutes prior to each race to lay/bet our selections.

Good on Betfair for revolutionising the world of punting - it almost makes you want the Poms to win the Ashes.

Hey, watch it there mate!

Yes, I was a bit too "over the top".

McGrath and Warnie will make sure it doesn't happen. I was going to back us at $1.40 on Betfair a few months ago but I thought the price was too short because any of our key players could have been injured in the meantime. Can't win them all, now we're at $1.20.

Well I reckon we are unders.

Betfair
 

Hi Everyone,

The moderator has taken the links out that I provided for pommie websites and thats fine and I understand why. If you cant make them out,leave an email address I will email them too you.

Your right michael, betfair and the pommies have revoltionised punting for all of us. Certainly for the punter who takes their betting seriously. With the discrepances in the odds too, Im now noticing more and more trading opportunites and the ability to make risk free profits on a regular basis.
And to think now with betting software programs and betting bots being devloped that will bet for us as long as we have the computer on and the software running. So we dont even need to be at the computer, it certainly makes it an exciting age to be betting in. Well, the possibilities are endless.
Hopefully, like you said liquidity will increase in the OZ market so we dont have to sit by the computer 'till just before the race starts. I do think its still a good few years away from that happening though. In the meantime, attack the pommie racing scene, or add it to your portfolio!
Where unders all right! 5-0 whitewash! Go the aussies! Actually, I hope the pommies win 1 early test to make it interesting.

Vance.

Hi Vance

Are you here or overseas, because unless you're using a proxy server you can't bet "in running" in oz.

Be careful trading weight of money, as there are a lot of "false" bets posted to trap the unwary. In my opinion the bots are the worst thing about Betfair. They stuff the markets around.

Vision through At the Races is not available unless you have a UK address.

We can however, watch some races on onextwo.de/en/wetten/wetten_start.asp

Good luck with it all.

Mark
 

Mark,

Thanks for your advice and caution. Cheers mate. I live in Sydney. You can bet "in running" from Oz you just cant do it over the internet. With Betfair, you can place an " in running" bet with them over the telephone.

Vance

INCORRECT
 

Mark,

I rang betfair a week ago and they mentioned it was legal to place an "in running" bet over the telephone from Oz. Uninformed customer service officer?! I thought this could open up potential trading opportunites with the market odds drifting depending on how the game was developing.
Anyway, ignore the last post because I have just contacted betfair to place a bet and they have since mentioned that it is illegal to do "in running" as you said from OZ.
Well, I will keep working away on the horses and dogies for now and see what comes up!
Thanks for your input Mark, appreciate it.

LAYING
 

Does anybody know if its possible to lay 2 or 3 horses and if one of the horses I have layed wins I dont lose any money or very minimal because of the money I have taken on the 2 others lays and the one I really like is if none of the 3 layed horses win I collect on all 3.

If this is possible sounds good to me , any clues anyone .

wombat2

Wombat

Of course it's possible.

eg Market is as follows and you don't like number 2, but also lay 1 & 3.

1 - 6.0 $20 payout $120
2 - 3.5 $120 payout $420
3 - 4.2 $40 payout $168

If 2 wins, you lose $240
If 3 wins, you win $12 (less commission of around $0.60c)
If 1 wins, you win $60 (less commission of around $3.00)
If any other wins, you win $180 (less commission of around $9)

If you didn't realise this until now, I'd tread very carefully on Betfair.

Wombat,

Yes. If you lay a number of runners then some of them can turn green.

I recall Mark claimed to consistently end up green on all runners by laying all of them. Pity he didn't mention how.

Anyway, if you lay a runner and it eases then you can try to lock in your profit by offering lays on other runners. I believe that is a good strategy.

Good point Jf.

I recall Mark claimed to consistently end up green on all runners by laying all of them. Pity he didn't mention how.


I'm sure a person of your great intellect understands percentages. Just make sure you lay over 100%. But that can't be done can it, or so 'they' keep telling me. The strategies are endless. All it takes is a little imagination.

And I've laid Marasco for a small fortune without going anywhere near Betfair ;)

Mark, I presume you're referring to the Pommy races where the liquidity is huge and the bet/lay prices on all horses are very tight, unlike most of our races.

If so, can your method(s) be applied to sports because the bet/lay price differentials are also very tight? Maybe the fluctuations are not as mobile as the horses which would spoil any sort of method to lay over 100%?

Mark,

I believe I understand the percentages better than the majority of Betfair players.

I typically offer Lays on the bid rather than take what's on offer. Therefore my bids usually get Laid in an over 100% market. Of course the Market has been known to take a turn against me.

Where I differ from you is that I don't get hung up on ending up all green. I simply try to keep my Risk below my comfort level.

Hi Michaelg

Not always, I worked 9 Australian races today into a no risk position.
I make books on just about everything on Betfair. Some of the more ridiculous events are the most lucrative.

31st August 2006, 10:11 AM
Mark
Member Join Date: Jan 1970
Location: Qld
Posts: 858



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I'll open this to anyone who takes the time to email.
I will reply only to those that leave their forum name.

This is not spam, not selling, but will try to send one example of yesterdays races as proof of what can be done.

I say try as I'm not 100% sure of copying details from betfair screens to emails.

Mark

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Just for you JFC. This is where I offered to show how it's done, but I don't remember hearing from you.

ps I'm not hung up on getting all green, but I treat punting as a business and like to win.

And that would have to be the easiest money I ever made. Marasco was never going to get a clear shot from barrier 1.

Thanks, Mark.

How do I e-mail you for an example? If its more convenient my address is mglfyl@primusonline.com.au

Michael.

Chrome, I also layed it but for an embarrassingly small amount.

Mark, could I have a look at that as well.
Many thanks.
jfimmer@ourbrisbane.com

Thankyou for your reply and offer .
My address is wombat2atinternodedotnetdotau

Cheers wombat2

You guys didn't check Mark's post, he was highlighting an old post where he offered examples, he wasn't offering examples now.

Also I strongly suggest disguising email addresses posted on the forum, the spam bots will fill your inbox before you know it.