Horse Trading Yet Again on Betfair
 

Hello everyone, I'm back again.

With the turnover charge dropped from Victorian racing from July 1, 2013 (but added onto the SA racing) I decided to give it a fair dinkum go today as previously the SA and Tassie meetings weren't really cutting it.

Due to my banning from Betfair during my last outing, as I was costing them money by trading on turnover charge markets but keeping my races under their imposed threshold limit (I was abiding by their rules but they still stopped me from trading), I will only be trading the markets that are not taxed (which basically at the moment is Victoria and Tasmania).

Two meetings were held in Vic today at Flemington and Seymour (none in Tas) and I have to say I had a great day with only one losing race of -0.11 cents. :eek:

While I know results like today will be few and far between at least I got off to a good start. :D

I will only list the profits/losses for this thread starting from zero rather than a bank as I've spent a bit of my previously listed bank. :oops: Lets just say the working capital/starting bank today was around $1223.

Session 1 (Sat 06/07/2013): Trading Profit Today +111.41 :) (16 races traded)

Running Total
$111.41

Well done TO. Some will scoff at the seemingly small amounts you win, but they add up.

Morning TO, good to see you are back at your craft and unhindered in yielding a positive return on your efforts.

Are you able to shed some light on the following?

1. What makes this particular angle on punting the best possible match for you, your own personal style and preferences etc ? I ask this because I have observed you searching for a 'grail' of a kind in other aspects, seemingly without much success (although I could be wrong).

2. Is this actually 'punting', or are you demonstrating the skills and attributes required for trading a market.. any market?

3. What can we learn from your successful trading endeavours e.g. find a niche and exploit it, look where few others are looking, target your own personal requirements for making additional disposable income first and then find an opportunity that consistently yields the required results, find a way to way to build an ark of wedge, one plank-profit at a time and sail the family around the world in it for an entire year ???*

Apologies for being so anal with regards my queries and somewhat theatrical with my suggestions here.. your detailed results and ample evidence for a successful strategy make me inquisitive to the bone, and keen to derive what lessons I can in this respect!

Cheers LG

* Beats buying a new lawnmower or lilly white washing machine?

Great to see you back TO, keep racking up those profits mate :D

Welcome back The Ocho, great stuff!



:D

Thanks guys. I'm not sure this will be compulsive viewing though going by today's effort :( with 3 meetings being available to me and with plenty of races where the volume or movement not really developing and then, if any, only with about 40 seconds to go. It's hard to trade in a stagnate market.

I'll try to answer your questions LG but some are a bit hard for me to answer.

1. What makes this particular angle on punting the best possible match for you, your own personal style and preferences etc ? I ask this because I have observed you searching for a 'grail' of a kind in other aspects, seemingly without much success (although I could be wrong).

Totally not sure why I can make money trading. It took a lot of practice and even still sometimes it doesn't pan out on a particular day but I just can't make money actually punting any other way. My automated grail crusade still takes up a lot of my thoughts. Every time I think I've found something the punting gods shoot my bots down including today with my bot suffering heavy losses. :(

2. Is this actually 'punting', or are you demonstrating the skills and attributes required for trading a market.. any market?

You are right that it is not strictly punting although I reckon the skills developed trading on BF do not translate into any other markets external to BF that I have tried. This includes other BF markets which are just not fast moving enough or UK horse racing which is too fast and which my software refresh rate lags behind usually leaving me exposed.

3. What can we learn from your successful trading endeavours e.g. find a niche and exploit it, look where few others are looking, target your own personal requirements for making additional disposable income first and then find an opportunity that consistently yields the required results, find a way to way to build an ark of wedge, one plank-profit at a time and sail the family around the world in it for an entire year ???*

There are many different ways to skin a cat is something I suppose people can take out of it. I definitely went into trading as a way to try and make extra money but it can also be like a challenging game.

* Beats buying a new lawnmower or lilly white washing machine?

:D Thanks for remembering some of the reasons I withdrew some money from my last effort. It would be great to make THAT much money to sail the family around the world but I don;t think that will happen unless the turnover charge is lifted from other states (particularly NSW which has by far the most meetings).

It's funny you should say that (sailing around the world) because my youngest daughter has gone to the UK for about 6 months and, as my other daughter has already moved out, we are missing her like crazy. I think they call it empty nest syndrome or something. It's a strange feeling. Not sure what to do or feel. :(

After all that I forgot to put up today's mediocre results.

It was a long hard slog for not much reward at all unfortunately and plenty of bigger losing races than yesterday.

Session 2 (Sun 07/07/2013): Trading Profit Today +17.54 :) (20 races traded)

Running Total
$128.95

Not sure what to do or feel?? Time to enjoy those quiet moments, mate.. I have somehow managed to lap most blokes my age - got a bunch of adult kids and find myself on the starting grid again with a 2yo.

Empty nest = party time my good man.. hubba bubba, BURN some rubba!

LG

Not sure about that LG :confused:

I had a bit of time today while working from home so traded the 8 races at Warrnambool. The first 2 races I thought I would let the trades ride (rather than hedging). The horses I traded didn't win including a rubbish effort from the shortie in race 2. I then hedged the remaining races for a small profit on the day.

It all helps I suppose. At least now I can afford to buy some $1 medium size coffees from Hungry Jacks ;)

Oh how I envy you full time punters (doing something you love to do). :(

Session 3 (Wed 11/07/2013): Trading Profit Today +$15.47 :) (8 races traded)

Running Total
+$144.42

Got off to my usual slow start today when trading some Geelong races in between my work commitments (a bit slow at the mo).

Then along comes race 6 at Geelong when I didn't get out in time. I should of had a $10 hedged profit but the race went in play and the only money on that horse (Chosen Son) would have meant I was in for a $26 loss if I hedged.

If that horse would have won I was staring down the barrel of a $200+ loss. Luckily the race caller was on the ball and kept me informed that Chosen Son was out the back and all over the track. I let my bet ride and won $45 in that race. Thanks mate. :)

I guess Chosen Son wasn't the one. :D

So I really only would have won about $17 today if it wasn't for that hiccup. While not strictly a trade I will take it as I would of had to take the loss if it was a losing race.

I most probably won't be posting any of Saturdays results tomorrow night as we are going out. I will update when I get time.

The beauty of trading is that it doesn't matter one iota what condition the track is in - you can still trade.

Session 4 (Fri 12/07/2013): Trading Profit Today +$52.21 :) (8 races traded)

Running Total
+$196.63

Applied that logic to my punting a long long time ago The Ocho, because despite what many say, the state of the track (unless we are talking a complete bog or torrential downpour) makes absolutely no difference to whether one can turn a profit or not.

Heavy(10)?? ppffftt - eat em for breakfast;)

Bog (15)??, Quagmire (20)?? ppffftt - trading wise it doesn't matter. :D

It does matter if you suck at trading though or if you're having a bad day as I did yesterday unfortunately. :(

I was checking out my profit after about race 5 at Caulfield when I was about $33 up. I thought this is rubbish. As it turns out I would have loved to finish $33 up. Races 6 & 8 at Caulfield and Launceston Race 6 were my worse races for a very long time. I guess I was going a bit overboard with the amount of money I was trading with and then not getting out as soon as the prices turned on me. Same old lack of restraint I'm afraid. Maybe it was because yesterday was the 13th.

It really didn't help that I couldn't trade the Launceston races until about 30 seconds before start time because of a total lack of money on those markets. Why wasn't there a second Victorian meeting yesterday anyway??

I'm not sure I can really trade profitably with such large gaps between races rather than one race after another when trading last time out. I can't get into the vibe of the markets. This turnover tax sucks.

Session 5 (Sat 13/07/2013): Trading Profit Today -$58.87 :( (16 races traded - Caulfield & Launceston)

Running Total
+$137.76

There is another alternative Flight lieutenant Ocho.. you could always try the emergency air-lock into the QQ thread.

Cheers LG

This is one of the funniest answers on a thread i have ever seen

Well thought of C.P.

Cheers.
Gary.f.

The QQ thread? What is this thing you speak of?

You jest surely, my forget-full Oracle? The Quest for the Quadrella of course. Drink from the chalice ..

Oh fortuna my dear Ocho, O Fortuna !

LG

I used to be forgetful but now I don't remember what I used to be. :D

Nutbag! You be the Captain of System C

LG

System C is not longer for me, LG.
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Well today was a colossal waste of time. Two Vic meetings were available today but Sunday markets aren't normally the best due to a lack of volume and liquidity most notably Warracknabeal. Added to this problem is that it is so hard to stay motivated when you are only trading two meetings 15 to 20 minutes apart. I just can't get into the flow.

I think I might rap it up here. It's just not worth me wasting my weekends on such mediocre returns or, worse still, losses. 9 hours over two days for losses or rubbish returns. It feels like a lost weekend to me now never to be regained. :(

Not that this was ever going to pay my mortgage off but at least it's supposed to bring in some coin. Maybe one day NSW and QLD can drop the turnover tax and it might be a different story.

I might have to try my hand at online poker again I think. :rolleyes:

Session 5 (Sun 14/07/2013): Trading Profit Today +$7.24 :) (17 races traded)

Running Total
+$145.00