ok, point taken, but what the hell happenned to "freedom of speech" is it a case of you're free as long as you don't rock the boat????

Hey, just use a bit of LOGIC like I am. Of course there is no such thing as freedom of speech if it means freedom to say and publish whatever you want. That is the LAW in this country.
Do you really think a newspaper will publish whatever letters are sent to it - to hell with the legal consequences to the newspaper? Why should this forum be any different? When a newspaper does publish anything controversial it has BEEN SEEN BEFORE PUBLICATION and costly investigative journalism has taken place. Do you expect the operators of this site to employ a team of investigative journalists? Just so anonymous people can post controversial comment? Do you think you can get up and say whatever you want on live radio? NO. Of course there's a time delay for live feedback? Do you think you can get up and say whatever you want on TV? NO. Why should this forum be any different?
Why should the business that operates this site and forum put itself at risk of court cases costing many thousands of dollars just so posters using fake names and hiding behind hotmail and yahoo addresses and who ultimately couldn't give two hoots whether the business operating this site goes down the gurglar or not post whatever they want to say, irrespective of the LIBEL LAW.

[ This Message was edited by: La Mer on 2003-10-29 09:53 ]

Exactly right!

Partypooper - what you have got to remember is this is a FREE forum provided by a COMMERCIAL business and they have every right to protect themselves from any possibility of legal action. If someone was to post something illegal or defamatory it will be the forum operators who are ultimately held responsible - not the poster so you cant blame them from erring on the side of caution.

Maybe you should think of it as being invited into someones home - whilst there you respect their rules even if they are not the same as your own. You don't go into someones home and light up a cigarette if they are non-smokers, etc. If you find you can't abide by their rules then don't go in!

We've got to quit complaining and enjoy what is.

I agree with you partypooper in every respect, but this is what is on offer and we all enjoy it, it would be a pity to see the community die because of something that could be avoided.

Reading between the lines it would seem that Management has been contacted by some upset vendors.

There are plenty of ways to get your point across elsewhere (and I intend to do so - but not here), so for the sake of the forum, let's not see it turn into a dead forum.

_________________
"The man who can correctly assess Class can have all the money he wants and he only needs a dollar to start". - Pittsburg Phil

[ This Message was edited by: Chrome Prince on 2003-10-29 12:15 ]

I consider myself wrist slapped, and step down on this one, though I was complaining ABOUT THE LIABLE LAWS NOT this forum, if that is understandable???

And agree, better as it is than not at all.

Hi partypooper, apart from the ever increasing forum hijacking, agree great forum.

Mr Logic, point taken about newspapers/liable etc etc. but isn't it a pity that they don't apply the same scrutiny to the purveyors of Horse Racing Sytems, Tips, Computer Programmes etc.???????? it seems that even the main racing publications will print any garbage you want there with NO fear of retribution!!! (as long as they collect the $ for the adds.)

I agree with you here, they should have to guarantee the validity of the claims made within the adds that they accept!!

Hi All,
I guess I am probably more to blame than anyone, for this I apologise, and promise no more crusading here as I, like all of you would miss our little chats, good fun and excellent information from a lot of the members.
I am not finished with my crusade, haven't had any luck so far but will continue, even more so now because of this forum being threatened with closure.
Just one point to management, it has been quite a few weeks since anything has been discussed about you know who so obviously a belated complaint has been made.
Just remember it was the editor of you know who that started the last thread so what did he expect, TO BE CONGRATULATED??????

Cheers Kenchar

i think we all know the score. let the forum go on. good on ya kenchar

cheers

umrum

Hi all,

Knocking anyone or any sevice or Mag. in a personal derogitory way is not ok and not on and I have never indulged in it. However some of the pro management passion expressed here perhaps requires the handing out of a few straws. Freedom of speech is another matter and I don't think it is being curtailed here in any way as there is a mutual dependance in operation between contributors and management.

Views and opinion are what make the forum vibrant and also what attracts advertizing.

The management are smart enough to know that without us there is no forum and no income full stop. However, management requires from us the recognition of their legal position and right to survive in the real world.

I don't think we need to fear a form of dictatorship here. The management are smart enough to realise that to curtail free speech would see a mass exodus of forum contributors that would turn this site to mulch.

Cheers.



[ This Message was edited by: crash on 2003-10-29 18:37 ]

G'day all,
Let's keep OUR forum alive.
If there is a new poster asking for advice, I am sure you knowledgeable{? spelling**** will be able to respond within the guidelines.
Cheers
P.S. BE PIS**** OFF IF IT WENT. :evil:

Crash,
I cannot agree that it is NOT on knocking any services, punting systems etc that make extravegant claims that are PROVED to be false as was the case here recently.


Even ProPun have a scammers section.


I totally agree with PartyPooper that it is totally wrong for newspapers and mags running any add they are given just for the advertising dollar, without any checking at all on the validity of the add.

I can totally understand managements position in relation to legal action, BUT this is where I believe the law is wrong in that they can be sued when what is posted can be proved to be true and backed by documentation.

An old saying THE LAW IS AN ASS.


I for one would welcome a day in court with a certain gentleman, but He would never do it as He knows that he would lose and the publicity would hurt too much, I am sure a Judge would see through twisted words in an add.

It is still going on even as today and it makes my blood boil.

Cheers

If you host a public forum one might reasonably anticipate that postings will contain, from time to time, remarks that carry a potential for Libel. The remedy today is as simple as it has always been - delete the offending posts. Provided the Forum is conscientiously edited in a timely fashion there can be no cause to complain by anyone (including temporarliy aggrieved parties).

Accordingly, the issue remains one of diligent Forum management. Failures of the past neither belong, nor deserve, to be put at the feet of well meaning Forum participants.

As far as day to day Forum management is concerned they are far more pressing matters that warrant attention.

Kenchar, yes that's the point isn't it? that if what's said is already proven to be true how can it be liable?? anyway good on ya!

From my admittedly miniscule understanding of the libel laws, truth is not necessarily a defence if the intent is malicious.

Personally, I have no argument that management need to protect themselves from action. I do find the fact that they can be sued for the comments made by other individuals does seem to be a little odd, but then again....

I do hope however that they don't err too far on the side of caution.

I think it might also be worthwhile for everyone to gain an understanding of what is and is not libel. I did a quick search of the web, and came across a few links, one of which is
http://www.uow.edu.au/arts/sts/bmar...defamation.html

This document is clearly (to me at least) a little onesided, but interesting reading all the same. If there's any sharks^h^h^h^h^h ooopss.. lawyers lurking perhaps they could provide some other links? (and if said lawyers take offence at my joviality please accept my most humblest and deepest apologies :smile:

Cheers,
Chris.

Very diplomatic stebbo :wink:

Now that Ke... I mean "certain contibutors" are no longer going to have swipes at a "certain publication" look forward to their adds here soon ! nuk nuk nuk, wink wink !

Cheers.

Stebbo,
Thanks for the legal link,very interesting reading, and it seems the old saying THE LAW IS AN ASS is quite true.

It is a crime that people, publications etc can basically advertise anything they like especially when proved to be false and there is no retribution.

I could make some comments about certain govt departments I have approached, but can't now because of restrictioms.

Cheers

[ This Message was edited by: quapi on 2003-10-30 11:36 ]

the whole society is screwed at the moment because of litigation and public liability. don't see why the internet would be any different.

cheers

umrum

Stebbo, of course youre right , silly me I was thinking terms of "common sense" but as many of us that have been through a Divorce Court know, you wont find much of it there! (within the Law"........................ ******** I hope thats not liable

UMRUM,
Don't know whether you saw it or not, but yesterday we had a news story on a bloke suing Tooheys because He hurt his thumb opening a twist top. Thank god sanity prevailed and it was thrown out with costs awarded against him.
I totally agree we are following the Yanks and going sue crazy.
When I think back over my life and all the things that have happened to me I probably could have sued 20 times.

Heres a real good one that happened a few years ago.
A woman of certain ethnic background was in my work premises and fell over.
She was laying on her back screaming she couldn't feel her legs. she said she was paralysed and the noise she was making was unbelievable.
The ambulance arrived and the officer raced in.
He asked the screaming woman the problem and she told him she couldn't feel anything from the waist down.
I swear what happened next is true.
He jabbed the biggest ************ pin I have ever seen into her foot.
She screamed even louder and said "what the f###### hell are you doing that hurt".
I laughed so much I was crying.
She STILL took my insurance co to court,again sanity prevailed,and she lost.

Cheers

thank christ for that hey kenchar.

Its up to the judges to use common sense.

cheers

umrum

MY post here has been deleted. If there was a valid reason I fail to even remotely see one from such a tame post.

Such technical language as "********" seems ok here [in this thread], but dont make any innuendo jokes [trying to lighten up this whole sorry business about libel], not even if you arn't attacking anybody? Was there a complaint about using the word "God" as an exclamation ?

Cheers.

dont know if there are any south park fans amongst our forumites. BUt this whole case reminds me of the episode where christmas is banned because it is offensive to certain groups who are prone to sue. Someone is even offended by mistletoe. ha ha.

It's all gone mad.

cheers

sorry crash and all, i expected the offending word to become ****

I see that another aussie forum sharing similar interests to ours (and frequented by a number of our forum folk) now seems to be a "closed" forum - very interesting :wink:

_________________
May the luck of the Irish be with you!

[ This Message was edited by: Paddy on 2003-11-04 05:45 ]

Fair comment is not defamation.

If there is documented evidence that a highly publicised system has failed to live up to its outrageous hype, you can make a "fair comment" on that.

Just be careful what you call them :razz:

As for this forum, anyone can host there own on a site like ezboard.com if you want more freedom.