What did Dittman do on his comeback, who did he ride for?

Beadman came back better than ever, and was instantly snapped up by the trainer.

Beadman is not perfect of course, but I'd be on his mounts any day.

As for slaughtering, I think that's an overstatement of fact. Many of the hotpots he rides should never be hotpots.

Beadman has won big races in Melbourne and Brisbane as well.

If you were Darren Beadman riding a horse in his last race going to stud for big money, you'd claim you were wrong too. A horse simply doesn't get beaten 6 lengths by horses he previously whipped due to jockey error.
Lonhro had had enough.
He'd won 4 group1 races in a row including an Australian Cup.
Darren said he should have gone sooner...Lonhro had no trademark zip left and was under the whip and struggling a long way out.

Had Beadman said that, what do ya reckon Hawksey would have said to him?

__________________
RaceCensus - powerful system testing software.
Now with over 413,000 Metropolitan, Provincial and Country races!
http://www.propun.com.au/horse_raci...ng_systems.html
*RaceCensus now updated to 31/01/2025
Video overview of RaceCensus here:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W821YP_b0Pg

Mahammed Ali tried to make a comeback too ...and failed. I suppose that makes him a has-been?

Time will tell if Beadman makes it into the Hall of Fame [Dittman has]. I wouldn't be putting money on it.

--------------------------------------------------

Australian Racing Museum Hall of Fame
[Jockeys]
W. Cook
E. Britt
M Dittman
W. Duncan
P.Glennon
R.Hutchinson
R. 'Toqo' Johnstone
R. Lewis
J Pike
Jack Purtell
J.Thompson
N Sellwood
H. White
B. Williamson

Inaugural
A Breasley
T Hales
R Higgins
G Moore
D Munro
--------------------------------------------

Ali has little to do with jockeys crash.

Boxers don't box into their 40's successfully, jockeys have been known to ride into their 50's.

Ali was a legend like him or hate him, but he didn't know when enough was enough.

Name one boxer who made a comeback at age and won just as many fights, not just one or two matches.

How many jockeys made a comeback and were as successful as Darren Beadman?

He does make mistakes, but he more than makes up for it.

Dittman was great in his hay day, but he didn't possess the judgement of Darren in my opinion, he was better in a close finish getting the most out of his horse, as you say "lifting" the horse over the line, Darren just judges his timing to perfection, so he doesn't have to "lift"

He knows what's in the tank and where and when to go based on what's left to nut the opposition on the line or streak away.

There is one other jockey who is an apprentice, who looks like he just might come close.

Your edited list also speaks volumes H White and R Higgins???

It's about achievements not necessarily consistent ability.

Where are M Clarke and G Childs and R J Skelton and B Thompson?

The difference between a good athlete and a champion is consistent skill, not necessarily top achievements.

To have two jockeys in the hall of fame known widely for "malpractice" shames the list.

You have the likes of R J Skelton who never achieved the heights of some others, but was consistently the best judge over distance.
He proved it time and time again. He had the inbuilt ability to time to perfection and more importantly rate the horse. He will never make the hall of fame, just because he never won a multitude of group one races, but his performance was amongst the very best.

__________________
RaceCensus - powerful system testing software.
Now with over 413,000 Metropolitan, Provincial and Country races!
http://www.propun.com.au/horse_raci...ng_systems.html
*RaceCensus now updated to 31/01/2025
Video overview of RaceCensus here:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W821YP_b0Pg

I'm not on the esteemed judging panel [obviously you think you should be] and the fact you think it's an 'edited' list [it's the full list] and you have given White and Higgins question marks, just exposes your ignorance chrome.

Harry White won 4 Melb. cups in 6yrs.and among his many other achievements were 2 Cauifield cups, a Cox Plate, 3 Newmarket Handicaps and three Futurity Stakes wins among 200 feature race wins, 60 of them G1's. Harry was the best stayer and hands and heels rider that ever mounted a horse.

Roy Higgins achievements were as good as they ever get, including 10 jockey premierships [a record he shares only with Bill Duncan] and is one of only two jockeys ever to top a 'century' of group 1 winners, 108 of them. The other jockey being George Moore who won 119.
Higgins rode over 2,300 winners including two Melbourne Cups, a Caulfield Cup, a Cox Plate, 4 VRC Derbies, 5 VRC Oaks and 4 Blue Diamonds !

Only one other jockey [Greg Hall] managed to top the $30,000 fine for dangerous riding your mate Beadman coped and there not the sort of records that make Champion jockeys.

we could debate this point forever and the bottom line is personal opinion,which we are all entitled to.When Dittman made his comeback he was nearly 40,a big age difference to when Darren came back.As has been stated,the Hawkes/Beadman combo is nearly always at poor odds relative to actual winning chance.I don't think Darren slaughter too many of his rides,but the pressure on him to produce is enormous.Harking back to Lohnro,his judgement was way out that day.And in the light of Robbo and Newitt copping 3 months for not giving their mounts every possible chance to win/place,why was there no enquiry into that ride?If Darren thought it had gone flat,why did he not tell Hawkes before the race and ask not to ride it?As for Lohnro in the Cox Plate,maybe it was the jockey who can't handle the Valley,not the horse.Does anyone have Darren's s/r for all rides at that venue alone?

Yeah it does come down to personal opinion.
People can see things 100 different ways.

I don't think I should be on the judges panel, I think all punters should be.
It shouldn't be a poularity contest, it should not be what the jockey achieved at his very best, it should be based on consistent riding skill.

Otherwise we may as well have Brew or Lovely Jubly as horse of the year.

I mentioned edited only because I replied to your post and then you added the list after. I didn't mean you had actually edited the list.

You can call me ignorant or whatever you like crash, but it consistently appears that anyone who has their own way of punting or their own way of looking at things is ignorant. It also appears that you think you are judge and jury in all things punting.

Calling people names is kids stuff.

Without mentioning names here (because of forum rules) the facts are that one jockey on that list who won a number of melbourne cups was well known for pulling horses, so much so, he earned a nickname that stuck with him for the rest of his riding life. Time after time he's position his mounts behind a wall of horses near the fence, with the horse bolting never getting a chance to get clear until it was too late. Then he'd return to the mounting yard with a wry smile on his face.

Another jockey also publicly admitted to doing worse than that....on more than one occassion. And that's just what he publicly admitted to.

But it seems you think the list should be based on the very best achievements of a jockey's career, rather than actual race skill.
Sure, jockeys don't win multiple cups and plates without skill, but it's trying your heart out all the time and being more right than wrong and overcoming adversity in running, taking needle eye openings and winning.

Beadman has won two Melbourne Cups also.

In closing, you'd rather have a rider who pulled horses declared a champion, than a rider who got fined for giving his mount every possible chance to win?

What has the world come to.

__________________
RaceCensus - powerful system testing software.
Now with over 413,000 Metropolitan, Provincial and Country races!
http://www.propun.com.au/horse_raci...ng_systems.html
*RaceCensus now updated to 31/01/2025
Video overview of RaceCensus here:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W821YP_b0Pg

No, if you back every mount they are poor odds.
Check out what I stated in this thread for yourself.

You can't tell if a horse has gone flat until you're in running and travelling poorly, unless the horse is truly flat at the stables.

To suggest Darren couldn't handle the Valley is ludicrous when the horse never travelled well at any point and was beaten out of sight, yet never held up for one moment.

__________________
RaceCensus - powerful system testing software.
Now with over 413,000 Metropolitan, Provincial and Country races!
http://www.propun.com.au/horse_raci...ng_systems.html
*RaceCensus now updated to 31/01/2025
Video overview of RaceCensus here:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W821YP_b0Pg

wh**** the ******** is with all the ********ing ***** in these posts??

Chrome,
you got me there on Lohnro in the Cox,but I would still be interested to see Dazza's s/r at that track alone.As you know,it is a different surface and a tricky circuit to handle,for both horse and jockey.Some handle it,some just don't.
IMO the Melbourne jockeys have the edge at that track.

5 wins from 42 rides but he has ridden some very long priced horses there.

I trimmed it down to horses in the market and his strike rate is very poor there, there aren't many rides though.

Here's a breakdown by tracks....

Moonee Valley 11.90% Profit $6.10
Caulfield 14.18% Loss $4.80
Flemington 10.36% Loss $21.60
Sandown 8.33% Loss $10.20

Doomben 11.11% Loss $39.70
Eagle Farm 12.50% Loss $32.60

Morphettville 20% Profit $0.50
Victoria Park - no rides
Cheltenham - no rides

Ascot - no rides
Belmont - no rides

Canterbury 20.65% Loss $46.70
Kensington 22.67% Profit $15.50
Randwick 19.24% Profit $19.50
Rosehill 19.61% Loss $88.90
Warwick Farm 19.92% Loss $120.50

The data is skewed by longshot winners, no. of rides bias etc.

I think the lack of strike rate interstate is due to unfamiliar pickup rides when travelling for a particular race. Other jockeys seem to follow similar patterns.

__________________
RaceCensus - powerful system testing software.
Now with over 413,000 Metropolitan, Provincial and Country races!
http://www.propun.com.au/horse_raci...ng_systems.html
*RaceCensus now updated to 31/01/2025
Video overview of RaceCensus here:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W821YP_b0Pg