OZmium Sports Betting and Horse Racing Forums

#21

18th January 2008, 06:19 PM

Chrome Prince Chrome Prince is offline

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Quote:

Originally Posted by King Cugat

well hang on there pal....an earlier post you said that this trainer nth of the border wouldnt risk his license to lay his horse. now your saying they wouldnt bother?

Again hes a little struggling trainer in QLD who felt the E.I. strains . Your saying that if he layed his horse to win $20k he might lose his license...then turn around and say $50k is ok?

this is getting more stoopid

the bottom line here prince is.
i made an observation that i thought looked very out of the oridinary on 1 particular race. the horse ran and was gone at the 500m mark according to the jockey.
You came on and started telling me about past things and i was wrong.
i said again that sure tomorrow at Sydney there will be many large lays that win. im not refering to them and when the time comes they should be based upon the environment at the time.
Why do i have to make an opinion or observation then told to prove it. An observation / opinion is exactly that. if every post on this site was told they must prove it then what would happen?
Does anyone ask Jimbo why he must prove that he hasnt tipped a horse?
DO we ask Pengo to prove he uses monopoly money to bet with?
Do we ask Mr Qauddie if he really does put $500 on everything he says he does?
if i didnt hear of what goes on i sstables in wouldnt have posted it. I too wiish it dodnt happen, i am also realistic enough to know that those blokes in the bush who dont get given chances with top class horses need to bet aswell.
There was a reason we didnt want betfair...you think that everyones kept their promise?
the first line on my thread was i still think its the #1 site for betting. I said that for more then 1 reason.....it helps more then desperate punters.

I said you are entitled to your opinion, but I don't agree with it.

But you said initially...

Someone knew exactly what was going on. This was 1 lone sole with an awfully big gripe with an odds on horse that just happened to tail right off.

And I disagree.

There are plenty of punters that know how Canterbury treats it's favourites.
and 50,000 is not a lot of money or liability when talking about $1.70 to $1.88.
And the hot Waterhouse favourite was beaten in a previous race.

You happened to see some money and a poorly performing horse.
Your conclusion is hype driven, but you're allowed to have it.

The reason of proof is because you are casting aspertions on the trainer and the jockey when it might be an innocent fumble.
It's unfair no matter who it is.

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#22

18th January 2008, 06:24 PM

crash

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Yep, agree with all that Chrome, but in my opinion and those of others I know close to the ground [the retired trainer here]and including my sister in QLD who runs the largest employment agency up there re- horse racing jobs - regularly admonishes me for punting because she 'knows' there is massive corruption in the industry.

One incident [re- kings complaint] doesn't prove anything. Maybe it was a rort, maybe not.

Last edited by crash : 18th January 2008 at 06:28 PM.

#23

18th January 2008, 06:28 PM

King Cugat King Cugat is offline

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Quote:

You happened to see some money and a poorly performing horse.

thats what i said in post #1
when was the last time you saw $50k being layed (not bet) at Canterbury?
I saw 1x $10k bet last night in another race...the punter took out a few numbers to get it too.
I havent made 1 reference to the trainer. i have made a reference to the person laying the bet. He could be an acquantance of an owner and have nothing to do with the trainer.
Your really getting away from your 2nd post there,

Quote:

If racing is so fixed why bother then?

Because it isn't.

wow that looks sillier then before

call it fixed, corrupt, or surviving, it happens more then a dozen times a day. But you claim it doesnt...your not in touch. Look at the posts by people other then me...they understand...is it that hard?

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#24

18th January 2008, 06:29 PM

Chrome Prince Chrome Prince is offline

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Then should we all give up?

No, we shouldn't because with all the corruption going on still 30% of favourites win.

Horses backed in win more than horses not backed.
Horses not backed still provide a nice profit.

It's all part and parcel of the game.

#25

18th January 2008, 06:33 PM

Chrome Prince Chrome Prince is offline

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I meant in the scheme of things, stings and cats will always pop up from time to time, but the statistics stay the same because overall racing isn't fixed, but a small portion of them are.

I don't think you can pick which one's are without knowing all the facts.

We have a choice, we can think we were dudded everytime a horse loses or recognise that sometimes we may have been dudded, but overall the horse just didn't fire.

I don't believe I've been dudded more than most and I don't believe that money equals a fix,especiallywhen it was the get out stakes last race, favourites have a terrible habit of being overbet atCanterbury and some bookies opened the favourite at $2.00 and may well have layed off the early money and there was plenty of money for the eventual winner.

Last edited by Chrome Prince : 18th January 2008 at 06:40 PM.

#26

18th January 2008, 06:38 PM

King Cugat King Cugat is offline

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Quote:

Originally Posted by crash

pretty much sums it up. coming from an x trainer too. It will continue to happen for as long as theirs money on the table.

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Its the ones you leave, not the ones you take, that give you the margin

Last edited by King Cugat : 18th January 2008 at 06:45 PM.

#27

18th January 2008, 06:44 PM

Chrome Prince Chrome Prince is offline

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Quote:

Originally Posted by crash

One incident [re- kings complaint] doesn't prove anything. Maybe it was a rort, maybe not.

And that's the crux of my argument.

Plenty of horses will go down the gurgler because they are animals, not because someone knew something.
Some will because it is a setup, but I think you'll find that the most lucrative setups are the horses that win.
Betfair will have reported that 50k, there's no doubt with their reporting contract.
How do you think the owner of the account will justify himself if it was a setup, he'll put everyone in the proverbial.

There are far easier ways to lay a hot favourite and no trace would show (effectively).

Last edited by Chrome Prince : 18th January 2008 at 06:50 PM.

#28

18th January 2008, 06:49 PM

King Cugat King Cugat is offline

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saying it was sus and saying it was a rort are worlds apart. i didnt think i went there. I said i noticed something was sus and i stayed away from the bet i would have normally taken. I still believe the layer knew something because of his chase and size of lay for that particular meet. Rort....perhaps some inside knowledge...can we settle on that then?

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Its the ones you leave, not the ones you take, that give you the margin

#29

18th January 2008, 06:52 PM

Chrome Prince Chrome Prince is offline

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No, actually I think the owner of the account "liked" something else

But it's all conjecture.

If I see an easing hot favourite and money and talk coming for another horse, it's easier to get rid of money laying the easing horse than ruining the price of the horse you want on a small liquidity market.

Stewards final report will spell it out - if we ever see it

Last edited by Chrome Prince : 18th January 2008 at 06:54 PM.

#30

18th January 2008, 06:57 PM

Chrome Prince Chrome Prince is offline

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King Cugat,

Apologies for getting heated mate.
It's no excuse, but I haven't been feeling well lately and my medication doesn't help.

Hope you have a lucrative weekend.

All the best.

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