Now much is made of POT (Profit on Turnover) as a measure of the success or otherwise of Ratings, Systems, Performance. For me, the MORE important consideration is POS (Profit on Stake)

We start each betting day with a stake. An amount we should feel slightly uneasy with if we lose it but more than happy with if we double it as profit!
In the attached sheet, based on actual bets placed yesterday, is a set of bets placed using a theoretical $500 initial stake.

As the day progresses we are doing quite well but take note of how the more you bet the more your POT decreases. If we set a target: that we want to double our stake, we should have stopped betting after bet 4. The punting Gods smiled on us and gave us another 6 opportunities to quit, but we ploughed on!

Then we started to hit the inevitable losing patch, had a choice to quit for the day or start implementing loss recovery by increasing stakes. NOT GOOD. We were given another opportunity to quit at bets 15 -17 but we ploughed on to be hit with another loss. We took a punt and increased our stake 10 fold, which paid off! At the end of the day we achieved our POS target for a measley 3.3% POT and had a free rollercoaster ride at Luna Park.

On another thread the question was asked, "When to Quit?". My answer is,"When you achieve your POS!".
Have a great day, RP

Attached Files

POS.xlsx (12.8 KB, 846 views)

You sound like a pom, they think like that and use ROI

__________________
One Drive

"If the corporates are treating you poorly , just go elsewhere."
"If they need you , they will soon find out."
"If you need them , you will soon find out." --moeee
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WRONG on both counts
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No I'm not a POM, a 4th generation Australian and:

POT is another name for ROI (UK term)
ROI or POT - Short for 'Return On Investment'or'Profit on Turnover' in percentage (%). The formula: = total profit / total staked * 100.
Example: if a series of 55 bets (all at $1 stake each) returned a profit of $7.50, then ROI/POT% = $7.50 (total profit) divided by $55 (total staked) multiplied by 100 = 13.6% ROI/POT

POS - 'Profit on Stake' in percentage (%). The formula: = total profit / initial stake * 100.
Example: if a series of 55 bets(all at $1 stake each) return a profit of $7.50, then POS% = $7.50 (total profit) divided by $1 (initial stake) multiplied by 100 = 750% POS


POS, ROI & POT all have the same result after one event. POS differs from ROI & POT after more than one event because POS is always based on the initial stake as the divisor.
RP

ROC does me just fine, these days = return on capital(initial sum in bank + any further deposits?)

Helps me back to reality i.e. bank interest!

LG

__________________
The trick isn't finding profitable angles, it's finding ones you will bet through the ups and downs - UB

The spin from the "R2W Axis at the SRA" boys must be affecting me....lol!!
RP

Just having a laugh with the pom joke, the way i understand they use ROI is if they started a series with $100 and finish with $110 that would be an ROI of 10%

But with POT if you started with $100 and had total bets of $500 and finished the series with $110 that would be a POT of 2%
Not sure why we use POT and they use ROI i prefer POT because i think it represents risk v reward in a better way.

__________________
One Drive

"If the corporates are treating you poorly , just go elsewhere."
"If they need you , they will soon find out."
"If you need them , you will soon find out." --moeee
_______________________________________________

ROI is actually an investing term so not sure why it is associated with betting.

ROI and POT are two completely different things.
Return on investment is the return on the capital invested. You allocate $1000 to your betting bank. This is your investment. After a year you end up with $2000 in the bank so you made 100% ROI. Some say they are going to put $1000 in but start with $100. In this case the ROI is 1000%.

POT is profit on turnover. You take the above $1000 and over the course of the year you have 1000 ten dollar bets and end up with $2000 in your bank. In this case you have outlaid $10000 in turnover and made $1000 profit, thus profit divided by turnover gives 10% POT.

You could argue that stake is your investment. Stake (the money at risk) is more an individual investment per venture. Hence while the bank is set up to pursue a specific betting angle, win or lose, only a portion is at risk at any time hence your stake is each individual bet.

To me you should Measure your betting success by focusing on betting bank growth.

The formula for calculating your betting bank growth ratio is:
Your Profit $ / Starting Bank $ = Betting Bank Growth Ratio

Understand that an effective betting strategy is one that delivers a balance between the volume of bets you have and your betting edge over the marketplace (your expected profit on each dollar wagered).

Ultimately your actual real dollars profit as a punter is the measure upon which you should judge yourself.

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Regards


Paul Daily - Ratings2Win Pty Ltd (Director)
R2W Axis - Axis is Australia's leading horse racing software and database; with sophisticated form analysis tools and accurate performance ratings that include Hong Kong.
http://www.ratings2win.com.au/

Not sure why you need to further complicate things here? You are merely re-labeling ROI or ROC.

Regards the relevance of using 'investment jargon' when it comes to the punt and regardless of our differing methods / approach, most of us are investing capital to generate positive returns and thereby increase the initial amount, surely??

LG

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The trick isn't finding profitable angles, it's finding ones you will bet through the ups and downs - UB